AFL clubs talk up community leadership while fostering pokie

[NRLCrap1]

okay, sure it does mate

=D> =D> =D> =D>

I expect that from an ignorant little weasel like you who doesn't understand AFL and doesn't want to because it's too complicated for your apology for a brain.

[pHyR3]

Again your missing the point just because your not interested doesn't mean others arn't!

are you talking about AFL or long distance events?

for long distance events, people are interested butnot as many as short ones like the 100m. cause thats what people like to see, power and speed. endurance is great, but not as entertaining or fun to watch.

[Swans4ever]

Again your missing the point just because your not interested doesn't mean others arn't!

are you talking about AFL or long distance events?

for long distance events, people are interested butnot as many as short ones like the 100m. cause thats what people like to see, power and speed. endurance is great, but not as entertaining or fun to watch.

How can you concede on the one hand AFL has great crowds but on the other hand state that AF is not entertaining and fun to watch - isn't that really just you being subjective? RL MUST be entertaining and fun to watch for those that watch - isn't it the same for those watching AFL - remembering that for CLUB football (I'm not talking about SOO or Rep matches as AFL has the AFL has none) that AFL even on the speculative ratings figures for TV - outdated NRL?

[NRLCrap1]

Oh you got him that time, Swans!!

[pHyR3]

Again your missing the point just because your not interested doesn't mean others arn't!

are you talking about AFL or long distance events?

for long distance events, people are interested butnot as many as short ones like the 100m. cause thats what people like to see, power and speed. endurance is great, but not as entertaining or fun to watch.

How can you concede on the one hand AFL has great crowds but on the other hand state that AF is not entertaining and fun to watch - isn't that really just you being subjective? RL MUST be entertaining and fun to watch for those that watch - isn't it the same for those watching AFL - remembering that for CLUB football (I'm not talking about SOO or Rep matches as AFL has the AFL has none) that AFL even on the speculative ratings figures for TV - outdated NRL?

i'm not saying it is NOT entertaining to watch for those who follow the sport. it is because they are invested in their team, the game and like the crowd/tribal mentality. and i mean, im sure it is still entertaining at times.

i'm saying that sports that exhibit power and speed are MORE entertaining to watch like NRL. Unfortunately, that is best seen on TV combined with the superleague wars has led to lower crowds and morepeople watching on TV.

[pHyR3]

sports usually find it difficult to shift support quickly because people love their sport primarily because they were brought up with it.

a truly exciting sport can introduce more and more new people that were NOT brought up with it. And I think that is in RL, personally I know few that were brought up with the sport in a household that was a RL but have adopted it in the early teens, including myself. I know quite a few that were brought up in RU households, I wasnt but i followed it quite a lot, but nearly all have turned to RL. There are tonnes that were brought up with it, dont get me wrong and that's a significant proportion of supporters.

I just think the exciting moments, the HOW DID HE DO THAT moments in RL outweigh AFL having watched many AFL highlight videos in the past few months after arguing with you lot. The best you will see in AFL is a 50m goal on the run, a nice mark or a sideline shot. None of them make you go HOW DID HE DO THAT because once you can kick that far and arent completely ****** you should be able to kick those every so often.

The marks, i admit are cool. The knee on shoulder thing (is there a name for that) is damn cool. But that's really about itt.

Whereas in RL you have flick passes, beautiful off loads, fends, chips and chases, amazing grubbers that thread the needles, amazing speed/acceleration or steps, great takes (which AFL does too and probably does better), cutout balls, dummy half runs, bombs, drop goals and efforts like these:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61iHH5z0zlw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2GMML_aO3A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdHA5FquOqU

[Swans4ever]

As I have said I grew up in Sydney RL and RU were all around me and in the 80's if you didn't follow it you were regarded as strange - as a soccer person and I would bet they say the same thing - it is personal preference, the people who follow AF say the same things about AFL that you say about NRL - I am not going to try to convince you are wrong as it's your preference, but for me having played both games it's AF that is the harder code with the higher degree of fitness and skill required a because thats my preference - to see Lewis Jetta run 150m and kick a match winning goal is more exciting or see him go head to head in the 2012 GF, or Micky O dive and take a breath taking grab in the 05 GF or Leo Barry's match saving mark or Kieran Jack dodge and weave around opponents and hit his target on the chest or Luke Parker make a crunching tackle - the list is endless. You just have to accept that it's my preference, one thing I am certain kids if introduced to both and not told to pick one or the other most likely play both - whether they ultimately choose one or the other may depend on them and their preferences!

[NRLCrap1]

i'm saying that sports that exhibit power and speed are MORE entertaining to watch like NRL.

And AFL! They display power and speed as well!

[AFLcrap1]

Yes, this is probably the only area where the NRL leads and AFL follows.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/af...-1226788374023

AFL clubs reject offer to help reduce reliance on poker machine cash

Eliza Sewell and Grant Baker
Herald Sun
December 19, 2013 7:00PM

AFL clubs have ignored an offer to help them get out of poker machines.

Victorian clubs instead are increasing their reliance on pokies cash.

It is now 19 months since AFL boss Andrew Demetriou said clubs had shown an interest in selling machines.

The league was "prepared to open the batting on being the intermediary for them", Demetriou said.

But the Western Bulldogs are seeking to add 18 machines at their Dromana venue - almost double the current number.

Carlton, Collingwood and Richmond have added more machines to clubs in Bulleen, Ringwood, Caroline Springs and Wantirna since Demetriou's statement.

Gambling-related revenue from the Victorian AFL clubs' 1466 machines tops $100 million a year.

In a witness statement linked to the club's application for new machines, the Bulldogs highlighted the gap in football department spending between the AFL's rich clubs and themselves.

The statement refers to 2010 football department spending of $19.1 million by Collingwood and $18.6 million by Essendon, compared with $14.5 million at Whitten Oval.

The Bulldogs have 45 active machines at two venues with 70 more ready to be deployed at the club's Edgewater development, which it expects to complete in time for the 2015 season.

As part of the Bulldogs' application to the Victorian Commission for Gambling and Liquor Regulation to increase the number of machines from 20 to 38 at The Peninsula Club, the Dogs' chief financial officer Anthony Tattersall said "our members demand that we must maintain our competitive focus in respect to our football operations".

Tattersall conceded the club had "continuing cash flow pressures from a significant level of trade creditors".

He said the club had a long-term commitment to "truly being the community club of the AFL" and the venue in Dromana "stays true to this objective".

A separate witness statement from Bulldogs chief operating officer Robert Stubbs said the club intended to reinvest money from the new machines into developing the venue.

"This application for an additional 18 EGMs (electronic gaming machines) is designed to provide the opportunity to further reinvest back into the community through expanded food and beverage offering and increase and improve the Peninsula Club's community outcomes within the region," he said.

In February, the Bulldogs made an equalisation submission to the AFL suggesting poker machine revenue above a certain amount should be pooled and shared between clubs.

The Dogs said such a scheme "might have the additional benefit of reducing the incentive of clubs to increase their own dependence and their fans' exposure to poker machine use".

Collingwood added six machines to its Caroline Springs club last month, but an application for eight new pokies at the Coach and Horses Hotel in Ringwood was knocked back earlier this year. The club added 20 new machines to the venue last year.

As part of the failed bid, Collingwood said it would make a $125,000 contribution to a community centre at Victoria Park.
Maroondah council rejected the Pies' claim of benefit, noting the money would be drawn from Ringwood to improve a centre in Collingwood.

Monash University gambling expert Dr Charles Livingstone said clubs were engaging in "predatory behaviour" by placing machines in venues that had no geographic relevance to the football club.

"Collingwood and Carlton and Hawthorn have all done that in the outer suburbs and that strikes me as being really quite predatory," Livingstone said.

"The way they see it is this is an easy way for them to get an extra million or two bucks a year."

HITTING THE POKIES JACKPOT

AFL club poker machines in Victoria: 1466

Gaming-related revenue: $104 million a year

CARLTON

Gaming-related revenue (GRR): $19.7m

Machines: 290

Manningham Club, Bulleen (90 machines)

Royal Oak, Richmond (80)

Club Laverton, Laverton (60)

Vic Inn, Williamstown (60)

COLLINGWOOD

GRR: $22.1m

Machines: 186

Coach and Horses, Ringwood (80)

The Club, Caroline Springs (66)

Diamond Creek Tavern (40)

ESSENDON

GRR: $13.7m

Machines:: 190

Essenson Football and Community Club, Essendon (100)

Melton Country Club, Melton (90)

GEELONG

GRR: $13.7m

Machines:: 180

Geelong Football Club, Geelong (100)

The Brook on Sneydes, Point Cook (80)

HAWTHORN

GRR: $18.5m

Machines: 155

Vegas at Waverley Gardens, Mulgrave (75)

West Waters Hotel, Caroline Springs (80)

MELBOURNE

GRR: $6.9m*

Machines:: 180

Bentleigh Club, Bentleigh (80)

Leighoak, Oakleigh (90)

Unattached machines (8)

NORTH MELBOURNE

No pokies

RICHMOND

GRR: $5.5m

Machines: 87

Wantirna Club, Wantirna (87)

ST KILDA

GRR: $750,000*

Machines: 83

St Kilda FC Social Club, Moorabbin (83)

WESTERN BULLDOGS

GRR: $4m

Machines: 115

Peninsula Club, Dromana (20)

Club Leeds, Footscray (25)

Unattached machines (70)

Note: Gaming related revenue derived from club financial reports for year ended October 31, 2013, except where indicated. Includes all revenue generated by social club activities.

* 2012 figure

[AFLcrap1]

AFL clubs claim rent for pokies venues, new signage as "community benefits"

Grant Baker and Eliza Sewell
Herald Sun
December 19, 2013 7:00PM


THE cost of running a pokies venue continues to be claimed as a community benefit by AFL clubs.

Pokie clubs operated by AFL teams must use a minimum of 8.3 per cent of their revenue to benefit the community to receive a tax break.

Monash University gambling expert Dr Charles Livingstone said the definition of "community benefit'' was too broad and some clubs claimed football-related expenses.

"How community purposes are defined is so loose that you could drive several thousand trucks through it," Livingstone said.

"It includes things like operating costs, wage bill, electricity, insurance.

"It's very, very easy for clubs (poker machine venues) to claim that 8.33 per cent without actually giving anything to a genuine community group.

"In the case of AFL clubs … it often includes the cost of running the social club and rebuilding bits and pieces."

The biggest "community benefit" across all clubs was the operating cost of venues, for example $870,000 for rent, wages and running costs at Collingwood's The Coach and Horses in Ringwood.

All four of Carlton's pokie venues claimed the cost of maintaining Visy Park, the Blues' home base, as a community benefit.

Of the nine Victorian clubs with pokies, the Western Bulldogs were the only club to spend any of its community benefit money on the prevention and treatment of problem gambling.

Collingwood nominated a gift that relates to "sausages given to Auskick for their fundraising activities" but also sponsored the Caroline Springs Football Club.

Essendon claimed $308,00 for maintenance of Windy Hill oval "for use by the community". The Bombers also claimed pay TV and discounted meals for members and visitors to its community club.

Geelong claimed costs relating to "football training", the installation of LED signage, construction of a corporate function room and interest and principal repayments on a refurbishment loan.

The Cats donated $20,000 to the Headspace youth mental health program.

Not-for-profit clubs pay 8.33 per cent less tax on pokies profits compared with pubs.

Dr Livingstone said clubs could take steps to help the community and minimise potential damage to punters.

"I think the best thing the AFL clubs could do would be, not necessarily to get out of pokies but to implement some reasonable harm minimisation measures such as $1 bets," he said.

"The impact on their revenue of using $1 bets would be modest - but it would be a magnificent demonstration of how easy it is to implement social reform and demonstrate that they were actually interested in the wellbeing of people."

[Raiderdave]

wow

it would appear all VFL clubs would disappear up their own arseholes .. if it weren't for poker machine revenue

I wonder how that sits with all those fumblers who claim its immoral & unethical for sports franchises to rely on the misery of gambling addicts to operate
they waved their figures & lectured us on this

we're community based member driven clubs & they provide all we need
oh my
now that appears to be nothing but verbal farts from the most hypocritical sport on the planet & its even more hypocritical fans

for shame
for shame

[Swans4ever]

wow

it would appear all VFL clubs would disappear up their own arseholes .. if it weren't for poker machine revenue

I wonder how that sits with all those fumblers who claim its immoral & unethical for sports franchises to rely on the misery of gambling addicts to operate
they waved their figures & lectured us on this

we're community based member driven clubs & they provide all we need
oh my
now that appears to be nothing but verbal farts from the most hypocritical sport on the planet & its even more hypocritical fans

for shame
for shame

Hahaha are you for fucking real - the raiders survive solely on Poker Machine Revenue, with only about 10k members crowds averaging the same and VERY little corporate support the Raiders consists solely on Poker revenue - what a fucking hypocrite!

[Swans4ever]

AFL clubs claim rent for pokies venues, new signage as "community benefits"

Grant Baker and Eliza Sewell
Herald Sun
December 19, 2013 7:00PM


THE cost of running a pokies venue continues to be claimed as a community benefit by AFL clubs.

Pokie clubs operated by AFL teams must use a minimum of 8.3 per cent of their revenue to benefit the community to receive a tax break.

Monash University gambling expert Dr Charles Livingstone said the definition of "community benefit'' was too broad and some clubs claimed football-related expenses.

"How community purposes are defined is so loose that you could drive several thousand trucks through it," Livingstone said.

"It includes things like operating costs, wage bill, electricity, insurance.

"It's very, very easy for clubs (poker machine venues) to claim that 8.33 per cent without actually giving anything to a genuine community group.

"In the case of AFL clubs … it often includes the cost of running the social club and rebuilding bits and pieces."

The biggest "community benefit" across all clubs was the operating cost of venues, for example $870,000 for rent, wages and running costs at Collingwood's The Coach and Horses in Ringwood.

All four of Carlton's pokie venues claimed the cost of maintaining Visy Park, the Blues' home base, as a community benefit.

Of the nine Victorian clubs with pokies, the Western Bulldogs were the only club to spend any of its community benefit money on the prevention and treatment of problem gambling.

Collingwood nominated a gift that relates to "sausages given to Auskick for their fundraising activities" but also sponsored the Caroline Springs Football Club.

Essendon claimed $308,00 for maintenance of Windy Hill oval "for use by the community". The Bombers also claimed pay TV and discounted meals for members and visitors to its community club.

Geelong claimed costs relating to "football training", the installation of LED signage, construction of a corporate function room and interest and principal repayments on a refurbishment loan.

The Cats donated $20,000 to the Headspace youth mental health program.

Not-for-profit clubs pay 8.33 per cent less tax on pokies profits compared with pubs.

Dr Livingstone said clubs could take steps to help the community and minimise potential damage to punters.

"I think the best thing the AFL clubs could do would be, not necessarily to get out of pokies but to implement some reasonable harm minimisation measures such as $1 bets," he said.

"The impact on their revenue of using $1 bets would be modest - but it would be a magnificent demonstration of how easy it is to implement social reform and demonstrate that they were actually interested in the wellbeing of people."

WHAT A FUCKING HYPOCRITE - AND HE ACCUSES AFL FANS OF BEING LIARS! TALKING ABOUT TAKING THE MORAL HIGH GROUND WHEN YOU BUILT YOUR WHOLE COMPETITION ON POKIES - A BIG HYPOCRITE!

[Raiderdave]

wow

it would appear all VFL clubs would disappear up their own arseholes .. if it weren't for poker machine revenue

I wonder how that sits with all those fumblers who claim its immoral & unethical for sports franchises to rely on the misery of gambling addicts to operate
they waved their figures & lectured us on this

we're community based member driven clubs & they provide all we need
oh my
now that appears to be nothing but verbal farts from the most hypocritical sport on the planet & its even more hypocritical fans

for shame
for shame

Hahaha are you for fucking real - the raiders survive solely on Poker Machine Revenue, with only about 10k members crowds averaging the same and VERY little corporate support the Raiders consists solely on Poker revenue - what a fucking hypocrite!

hmmmmm
don't remember the Raiders CEO lecturing anyone about poker machine use
or our Chairmen

our any Raiders fans about it either

but that's all we get from weedy little shirt lifting fumblers like you

its immoral
its unethical
its not in the communities


Gutless
yellow

& complete & utter hypocrites
this is your typical fumbleball club... & their weedy little slime bag fans

for shame
for shame

[Raiderdave]

AFL clubs claim rent for pokies venues, new signage as "community benefits"

Grant Baker and Eliza Sewell
Herald Sun
December 19, 2013 7:00PM


THE cost of running a pokies venue continues to be claimed as a community benefit by AFL clubs.

Pokie clubs operated by AFL teams must use a minimum of 8.3 per cent of their revenue to benefit the community to receive a tax break.

Monash University gambling expert Dr Charles Livingstone said the definition of "community benefit'' was too broad and some clubs claimed football-related expenses.

"How community purposes are defined is so loose that you could drive several thousand trucks through it," Livingstone said.

"It includes things like operating costs, wage bill, electricity, insurance.

"It's very, very easy for clubs (poker machine venues) to claim that 8.33 per cent without actually giving anything to a genuine community group.

"In the case of AFL clubs … it often includes the cost of running the social club and rebuilding bits and pieces."

The biggest "community benefit" across all clubs was the operating cost of venues, for example $870,000 for rent, wages and running costs at Collingwood's The Coach and Horses in Ringwood.

All four of Carlton's pokie venues claimed the cost of maintaining Visy Park, the Blues' home base, as a community benefit.

Of the nine Victorian clubs with pokies, the Western Bulldogs were the only club to spend any of its community benefit money on the prevention and treatment of problem gambling.

Collingwood nominated a gift that relates to "sausages given to Auskick for their fundraising activities" but also sponsored the Caroline Springs Football Club.

Essendon claimed $308,00 for maintenance of Windy Hill oval "for use by the community". The Bombers also claimed pay TV and discounted meals for members and visitors to its community club.

Geelong claimed costs relating to "football training", the installation of LED signage, construction of a corporate function room and interest and principal repayments on a refurbishment loan.

The Cats donated $20,000 to the Headspace youth mental health program.

Not-for-profit clubs pay 8.33 per cent less tax on pokies profits compared with pubs.

Dr Livingstone said clubs could take steps to help the community and minimise potential damage to punters.

"I think the best thing the AFL clubs could do would be, not necessarily to get out of pokies but to implement some reasonable harm minimisation measures such as $1 bets," he said.

"The impact on their revenue of using $1 bets would be modest - but it would be a magnificent demonstration of how easy it is to implement social reform and demonstrate that they were actually interested in the wellbeing of people."

WHAT A FUCKING HYPOCRITE - AND HE ACCUSES AFL FANS OF BEING LIARS! TALKING ABOUT TAKING THE MORAL HIGH GROUND WHEN YOU BUILT YOUR WHOLE COMPETITION ON POKIES - A BIG HYPOCRITE!

what
no challenging the author of the Story to sort it out in the ring ?

look out guys
this one will go Ali on yr arses

:_<> :_<> :_<>
what a ta.rd