A-League could become outright second code from NRL

[Fred]

And don't get me wrong, it would be great if you saw kids playing rl or union in the park or people talked about it a lot etc etc ... That there was at least a larger presence .... But there isn't ... I think that is where the previous rl admin got it wrong ... They just thought there was maybe or that it would grow as they thought the rest of Australia was like Sydney ??? Who knows.

[pHyR3]

The difference is, in Victoria rl participation is very low. Most other sports would be bigger. Soccer obviously, but baseball, hockey, basketball, tennis ... Basically think of any main stream sport, would be bigger and could be played at a senior or junior level across the whole state with leagues on each region, area. Rl however has very little representation with there being one leauge of a few clubs covering Melbourne Metro and Geelong ... A very large geographical area. Whereas you look at AFL in Sydney alone and they have 5 leagues alone. That is where the difference is I think. Is it the main game, no way by a long shot; does it have a good presence across grass roots and a niche market .. Definitely. Storm too have a niche market in Victoria but the grass roots presence of rl is so small, that it is well down the pecking order and really not even in the minor sports category. You want go driving around Melbourne seeing junior rl being played too much or even casually in a park . I had never seen it. Soccer ... All the time, AFL obviously, basketball all the time, tennis .. Yep. Whereas you drive around the Gold Coast and you see AFL ovals everywhere, AFL posts in a lot of schools ... And also hybrid posts of league and AFL.. People playing AFL and union/league in parks beaches etc.

Firstly, there is an element of confirmation bias. Secondly, AFL has invested in grassroots better than NRL, I've said many times that if NRL had AFL management crowds would be 20k+ by now and every GF rating 4milion+. But it's only recently, i.e. this year, started to improve slightly in SOME areas through the independent management. Thirdly, a large source of league players is from union: http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union ... 2u5bk.html

And league also sources from NZ and the islands, Fiji, PNG etc.

[NRLCrap1]

As for grassroot support, I know tonnes of people who play soccer and follow league. Similarly, many people play or played union and follow league, including myself. Talking to people who grew up in 'rugby union heartland' in sydney, they know little of union except the rugby world cup and the occasional bledisloe.

And again, you AFL supporters invalidate any stat i provide that supports nrl. dunno why i even bother.

Well argue against this stat then.

Rugby league clubs in Melbourne (not including the Storm): 10
Soccer clubs in Melbourne (not including the Victory and the Heart): Too many to count!
http://www.sportingpulse.com/assoc_page ... -0&a=CLUBS

[Swans4ever]

I think that amount of junior soccer clubs would be similar Australia wide

[cos789]

I think that amount of junior soccer clubs would be similar Australia wide

Except for Sydney where junior soccer dominates like AFL in Melbourne.

[cos789]

I've said many times that if NRL had AFL management crowds would be 20k+ by now and every GF rating 4milion+.

No, because your product is different.
People don't follow a sport becuase it's well managed
though they will jump ship if it is mis managed.

[pHyR3]

I've said many times that if NRL had AFL management crowds would be 20k+ by now and every GF rating 4milion+.

No, because your product is different.
People don't follow a sport becuase it's well managed
though they will jump ship if it is mis managed.

Right, so grassroot development, good rules, movement to large stadia, advertising and marketing have 0 impact on crowds. Ok.

[NRLCrap1]

They have an impact, Phy, but not as big an impact as you think. If the product isn't appealling then no amount of all those factors will expand the sport. If the NRL want to make a go of things they have to change the fan culture, and that IMO starts with taking all games off live coverage against the gate and telling the fans "if you want to see the game live, go to the venue". This will show just where the real following of the game stands and if crowds don't improve start listening to the fans and demand to know what they want in order to get them to go to games.

[Swans4ever]

A-League got 17 1/2 k average over weekend - which puts them ahead of RL, will they finish with a higher crowd average?

[cos789]

I've said many times that if NRL had AFL management crowds would be 20k+ by now and every GF rating 4milion+.

No, because your product is different.
People don't follow a sport becuase it's well managed
though they will jump ship if it is mis managed.

Right, so grassroot development, good rules, movement to large stadia, advertising and marketing have 0 impact on crowds. Ok.

I didn't say that did I.
If a sport is well managed it will achive a certain level if not then a lower level.
Or tink of it this way - a well managed AFL will always achieve higher KPIs than a well managed nrl.

But in particular.
What grassroots development is going to the scenario in rl "heartlands"?
Moving to large empty stadia has proven to be a total embarassment for rl.
RL already receive saturation adverting and marketing.
Rules of rl are minimal so tweaking is not going produce huge changes.

[pHyR3]

I've said many times that if NRL had AFL management crowds would be 20k+ by now and every GF rating 4milion+.

No, because your product is different.
People don't follow a sport becuase it's well managed
though they will jump ship if it is mis managed.

Right, so grassroot development, good rules, movement to large stadia, advertising and marketing have 0 impact on crowds. Ok.

I didn't say that did I.
If a sport is well managed it will achive a certain level if not then a lower level.
Or tink of it this way - a well managed AFL will always achieve higher KPIs than a well managed nrl.

But in particular.
What grassroots development is going to the scenario in rl "heartlands"?
Moving to large empty stadia has proven to be a total embarassment for rl.
RL already receive saturation adverting and marketing.
Rules of rl are minimal so tweaking is not going produce huge changes.

Okay, grassroots development needs to be better invested in the richer areas of Sydney, Brisbane, Victoria and Perth. And NZ south island too. More money basically, more effort and more effective strategies that attract kids.
Well, moving to the ANZ has been good for Souths who are going for 32k members this year and will probs get 25k+. Same with the dogs. The AFL moved 20 years ago, and improved crowds since as a result. Better facilities, better transport, bigger capacity so it rarely sells out.
RL advertising has been poor at best, how is it saturated? i've rarely seen the shitty ad they had going this year, games are poorly advertised by clubs and need better presence especially on TV.
Don't talk about the rules since you clearly have no idea. I could give you a page of things they need to fix up for 2014 and beyond.

[NRLCrap1]

AFL has rules problems as well, but you don't see that affecting our crowds!!!

[ParraEelsNRL]

A-League got 17 1/2 k average over weekend - which puts them ahead of RL, will they finish with a higher crowd average?

[NRLCrap1]

Don't laugh, ParraEel. It could happen you know!

[adamj1300]

I've said many times that if NRL had AFL management crowds would be 20k+ by now and every GF rating 4milion+.

No, because your product is different.
People don't follow a sport becuase it's well managed
though they will jump ship if it is mis managed.

Right, so grassroot development, good rules, movement to large stadia, advertising and marketing have 0 impact on crowds. Ok.

grassroots is where the kids pick most of their interest in sports, teams they follow & then chooses weather they wants to play it or be involved in it. the last 10, 15 years the AFL has invested heavily in junior programs to attract new interest. especially in QLD.

centralizing games to newer state of the ART stadiums, eg Allianz Stadium, new stadiums rather than the traditional, dated grounds where they have little cover & people sit in the rain on bench seats, or grass, families will be more inclined to show up