Talking Footy

WHAT a load of morons we can be. The ARL Commission has sensibly banned the shoulder charge for it is an unnecessary and dangerous weapon, one that has put NRL players at great risk. Yet predictably voices shout loud in its defence and want it retained.

Some players, coaches and supporters have publicly ridiculed the commission. They demand that rugby league will be a reduced sport and spectacle now that the bump-into-oblivion has been laid to rest.

Sonny Bill Williams, considered a guru of the now outlawed assault, has tweeted: "You need good timing and technique to pull off a shoulder charge." But wait there's more: "Simply put, if you can't do it don't try - this is league not tiddlywinks!"

This is instructive for two reasons. Williams has glorified the charge as some sort of science - which it isn't. Up until this week it has been legalised thuggery. And second, Williams thinks there is a bunch of rugby league supporters wandering about confused by the lack of small, coloured discs in NRL games. Poor sods. Poor Sonny Bill.
. .
If rugby league needs the shoulder charge to stay relevant and exciting then it is a sport without guile or value. And possibly a future. Supporters and players too easily confuse violence with ruggedness. There is nothing tough about the shoulder charge. No courage is required to run hard at a player who is blind to the coming assault and therefore defenceless.

The decision to make the shoulder charge illegal showed good resolve from the new commission. It was never going to be a popular verdict within the rugby league community. With the appointment of Dave Smith as chief executive yesterday, rugby league has finished the year with energy and a genuine sense of leadership.

It is not a boast the AFL could make. The national draft held on the Gold Coast on Thursday night was the final play of the year other than some mopping up with the pre-season and rookie draft next month. It signals the end of the 2012 football year and beginning of the 2013 dreaming. The flood of new, young blood through the draft gives everyone new hope.

The AFL administration, however, will review a most uneven and unhappy year. It began weakly with the announcement in February of a $23.6 million loss for 2011. The expansion funding of the Gold Coast and GWS savaged the AFL bank book. It has ended with two investigations that run deep into the integrity of the league. Melbourne faces allegations that it deliberately lost matches to improve its draft pick and Adelaide, its chief executive officer Steven Trigg and player Kurt Tippett face charges of fiddling with the draft and fiddling the salary cap books.

In between there has been the Wangaratta fiasco, which saw a pretentious Essendon attempt to fly to the Victorian town for a practice match rather than take a bus. The plane could not land because of bad weather and Essendon drowned in its own hubris. The AFL awarded the match to St Kilda.

Melbourne's talented indigenous forward Liam Jurrah was charged with serious assault and recruiter Matt Rendell was sacked by Adelaide after it was learnt he had said that it might be necessary to overlook an indigenous player who did not have a white parent. Rendell made the comment to AFL community manager Jason Mifsud while explaining the difficulty of recruiting indigenous footballers.

In April, Melbourne was forced to dump its major sponsor after the company's chief executive Ben Polis ran a stream of racist comments on social media. As the season rolled on Matt Primus was sacked as Port Adelaide coach and Hawthorn coach Alastair Clarkson was suspended by a junior league for abusing a teenage umpire.

Tom Liberatore, son of 1990 Brownlow Medallist Tony, was suspended by the Bulldogs for four weeks after he was found by police drunk and in possession of an illicit drug. Stephen Milne was fined after a homophobic comment directed at Collingwood's Harry O'Brien. When it was all over, attendance had fallen to its lowest level since 2006.

The biggest loser in a poor year has been the AFL Commission itself. While we await the results of inquiries into Melbourne and Adelaide it is the performance of chairman Mike Fitzpatrick's board that has been most disappointing.

The Melbourne probe is looking at tanking in season 2009. It was well known back then that Melbourne and other teams had deliberately under-performed to improve their draft picks. The AFL said it wasn't happening.

Even when the then coach Dean Bailey said after his sacking in 2010 that he had coached in a manner that would help the club get the draft picks it wanted, the commission denied the existence of tanking.

And when Brock McLean, a former Melbourne player, admitted on pay-TV that Blind Freddy could have seen what was at play with the Demons in 2009, the AFL again denied that tanking was taking place on Fitzpatrick's watch. Here was an administration and its commission that fundamentally did not understand the sport it was chosen and paid to govern.

The Adelaide-Tippett saga should be finalised next Friday when player, club and chief executive get to state their cases. But the AFL has only just stumbled on to the Tippett story he had an understanding with the club that he would be released for a second round draft pick although it has been common knowledge for more than a year.

The AFL Commission has been lauded as the best leadership and governance in Australian sport. Maybe we have been so besotted with its qualities because there was precious little to compare it with. Racing is a mess with a national body that is without muscle. The NRL was compromised by the involvement of News Ltd and rugby union is working its way through the 19th century.

Now that the ARL Commission has a full understanding of its business and sport we might just see the AFL Commission for what it really is. Both plodding and pompous.


AFL falling apart

where in that article did it say the AFL was falling apart?

Most of the points will be irrelevant. Tanking is under major investigation and is a dodo anyway given the priority pick is gone. The uneven comp will balance as the Suns and Giants mature. Attendance fell mainly due to one-off factors that will resolve in coming years, such as stadium renovations, uneven games, and live AFL for the first time.

But I especially like this comment:

If rugby league needs the shoulder charge to stay relevant and exciting then it is a sport without guile or value. And possibly a future. Supporters and players too easily confuse violence with ruggedness. There is nothing tough about the shoulder charge. No courage is required to run hard at a player who is blind to the coming assault and therefore defenceless.

How true. The outrage by RL fans and players is hilarious

But lets get real here. This is the OPINION of Patrick Smith. He has zero credibility and will take a shot at anything AFL because it keeps him in a job.

Yes what a Farce the AFL has become.

Integrity of the competition at a all time low.

1. Lobsided competition like never see before.
2. Tanking rife.
3. Salary cap rorts being swept under the carpet.
4. Rigged competition by the AFL, salary cap concessions that are = to the Melbourne storm cap rorts. Draft picks to these expansion sides like never seen before.
5. Massive drop in crowd numbers 10% in 2012, 6% in 2011.
6. Racism/racist culture

Melbourne's talented indigenous forward Liam Jurrah was charged with serious assault and recruiter Matt Rendell was sacked by Adelaide after it was learnt he had said that it might be necessary to overlook an indigenous player who did not have a white parent. Rendell made the comment to AFL community manager Jason Mifsud while explaining the difficulty of recruiting indigenous footballers.

In April, Melbourne was forced to dump its major sponsor after the company's chief executive Ben Polis ran a stream of racist comments on social media. As the season rolled on Matt Primus was sacked as Port Adelaide coach and Hawthorn coach Alastair Clarkson was suspended by a junior league for abusing a teenage umpire.

Tom Liberatore, son of 1990 Brownlow Medallist Tony, was suspended by the Bulldogs for four weeks after he was found by police drunk and in possession of an illicit drug. Stephen Milne was fined after a homophobic comment directed at Collingwood's Harry O'Brien. When it was all over, attendance had fallen to its lowest level since 2006.

The biggest loser in a poor year has been the AFL Commission itself. While we await the results of inquiries into Melbourne and Adelaide it is the performance of chairman Mike Fitzpatrick's board that has been most disappointing.

The Melbourne probe is looking at tanking in season 2009. It was well known back then that Melbourne and other teams had deliberately under-performed to improve their draft picks. The AFL said it wasn't happening.

Even when the then coach Dean Bailey said after his sacking in 2010 that he had coached in a manner that would help the club get the draft picks it wanted, the commission denied the existence of tanking.

And when Brock McLean, a former Melbourne player, admitted on pay-TV that Blind Freddy could have seen what was at play with the Demons in 2009, the AFL again denied that tanking was taking place on Fitzpatrick's watch. Here was an administration and its commission that fundamentally did not understand the sport it was chosen and paid to govern.

The Adelaide-Tippett saga should be finalised next Friday when player, club and chief executive get to state their cases. But the AFL has only just stumbled on to the Tippett story he had an understanding with the club that he would be released for a second round draft pick although it has been common knowledge for more than a year.

The AFL Commission has been lauded as the best leadership and governance in Australian sport. Maybe we have been so besotted with its qualities because there was precious little to compare it with. Racing is a mess with a national body that is without muscle. The NRL was compromised by the involvement of News Ltd and rugby union is working its way through the 19th century.

Now that the ARL Commission has a full understanding of its business and sport we might just see the AFL Commission for what it really is. Both plodding and pompous.

The Last part just sums up the AFL commission's performance perfectly.

AFL a rabble... =D> =D>

eelofwest wrote:

Yes what a Farce the AFL has become.

Integrity of the competition at a all time low.

1. Lobsided competition like never see before.
2. Tanking rife.
3. Salary cap rorts being swept under the carpet.
4. Rigged competition by the AFL, salary cap concessions that are = to the Melbourne storm cap rorts. Draft picks to these expansion sides like never seen before.
5. Massive drop in crowd numbers 10% in 2012, 6% in 2011.
6. Racism/racist culture

Wow, what a fool

1. The price of expansion - it will be resolved in 2-3 years
2. One club is being investigated for tanking. ONE. How is that "rife"? The incentive for tanking has been eliminated anyway
3. How is an investigation that hasnt been finished "sweeping it under the carpet"? The crows have already said in todays paper that they expect a massive hit.
4. Coming from a RL supporter where the storm have made 5 of the last 8 GF's. Sydney have won just 2 GFs in their 32 yr history.
5. It will rise.
6. The AFL acted swiftly on 3 incidents during the year. The NRL let their incidents go unpunished

Way to fail hard eels

eelofwest wrote:

Yes what a Farce the AFL has become.

Integrity of the competition at a all time low.

1. Lobsided competition like never see before.
2. Tanking rife.
3. Salary cap rorts being swept under the carpet.
4. Rigged competition by the AFL, salary cap concessions that are = to the Melbourne storm cap rorts. Draft picks to these expansion sides like never seen before.
5. Massive drop in crowd numbers 10% in 2012, 6% in 2011.
6. Racism/racist culture

Don't for get all the clubs going broke because of all the Hu$h money

Xman wrote:

eelofwest wrote:

Yes what a Farce the AFL has become.

Integrity of the competition at a all time low.

1. Lobsided competition like never see before.
2. Tanking rife.
3. Salary cap rorts being swept under the carpet.
4. Rigged competition by the AFL, salary cap concessions that are = to the Melbourne storm cap rorts. Draft picks to these expansion sides like never seen before.
5. Massive drop in crowd numbers 10% in 2012, 6% in 2011.
6. Racism/racist culture

Wow, what a fool

1. The price of expansion - it will be resolved in 2-3 years
2. One club is being investigated for tanking. ONE. How is that "rife"? The incentive for tanking has been eliminated anyway
3. How is an investigation that hasnt been finished "sweeping it under the carpet"? The crows have already said in todays paper that they expect a massive hit.
4. Coming from a RL supporter where the storm have made 5 of the last 8 GF's. Sydney have won just 2 GFs in their 32 yr history.
5. It will rise.
6. The AFL acted swiftly on 3 incidents during the year. The NRL let their incidents go unpunished

Way to fail hard eels

1. I'll believe that when I see it!
2. It's more than one that's been accused of it!
3. He's talking about Judd and all the other third party deals, X! Not the Crows!
4. And since we were punished we are still up there! And you forgot about the Lions and their three-peat!
5. And pigs fly as well.
6. 3 incidents huh? What about the ones that weren't reported?

Way to fail yourself, X!

Striker wrote:

Xman wrote:

eelofwest wrote:

Yes what a Farce the AFL has become.

Integrity of the competition at a all time low.

1. Lobsided competition like never see before.
2. Tanking rife.
3. Salary cap rorts being swept under the carpet.
4. Rigged competition by the AFL, salary cap concessions that are = to the Melbourne storm cap rorts. Draft picks to these expansion sides like never seen before.
5. Massive drop in crowd numbers 10% in 2012, 6% in 2011.
6. Racism/racist culture

Wow, what a fool

1. The price of expansion - it will be resolved in 2-3 years
2. One club is being investigated for tanking. ONE. How is that "rife"? The incentive for tanking has been eliminated anyway
3. How is an investigation that hasnt been finished "sweeping it under the carpet"? The crows have already said in todays paper that they expect a massive hit.
4. Coming from a RL supporter where the storm have made 5 of the last 8 GF's. Sydney have won just 2 GFs in their 32 yr history.
5. It will rise.
6. The AFL acted swiftly on 3 incidents during the year. The NRL let their incidents go unpunished

Way to fail hard eels

1. I'll believe that when I see it!
2. It's more than one that's been accused of it!
3. He's talking about Judd and all the other third party deals, X! Not the Crows!
4. And since we were punished we are still up there! And you forgot about the Lions and their three-peat!
5. And pigs fly as well.
6. 3 incidents huh? What about the ones that weren't reported?

Way to fail yourself, X!

1. Well the vast majority of AFL experts say this is inevitable.
2. Such as? Again, its finished now anyway
3. Judd? He has a contract with Visy. IS that not allowed? Wow, there goes sports sponsorship!
4. The storms punishment was shown to be inadequate. Whats this got to do with the Lions?
5. So renavations to the SCG and Skilled stadium didnt affect crowds? anyway we will see
6. Pffft. All we can judge is how the AFL acted on those incidents that were reported. They acted swiftly and harshly every time. Howd the NRL do? Nothing!

Continuing the failing striker. Strike out

Xman wrote:

Striker wrote:

Xman wrote:

Wow, what a fool

1. The price of expansion - it will be resolved in 2-3 years
2. One club is being investigated for tanking. ONE. How is that "rife"? The incentive for tanking has been eliminated anyway
3. How is an investigation that hasnt been finished "sweeping it under the carpet"? The crows have already said in todays paper that they expect a massive hit.
4. Coming from a RL supporter where the storm have made 5 of the last 8 GF's. Sydney have won just 2 GFs in their 32 yr history.
5. It will rise.
6. The AFL acted swiftly on 3 incidents during the year. The NRL let their incidents go unpunished

Way to fail hard eels

1. I'll believe that when I see it!
2. It's more than one that's been accused of it!
3. He's talking about Judd and all the other third party deals, X! Not the Crows!
4. And since we were punished we are still up there! And you forgot about the Lions and their three-peat!
5. And pigs fly as well.
6. 3 incidents huh? What about the ones that weren't reported?

Way to fail yourself, X!

1. Well the vast majority of AFL experts say this is inevitable.
2. Such as? Again, its finished now anyway
3. Judd? He has a contract with Visy. IS that not allowed? Wow, there goes sports sponsorship!
4. The storms punishment was shown to be inadequate. Whats this got to do with the Lions?
5. So renavations to the SCG and Skilled stadium didnt affect crowds? anyway we will see
6. Pffft. All we can judge is how the AFL acted on those incidents that were reported. They acted swiftly and harshly every time. Howd the NRL do? Nothing!

Continuing the failing striker. Strike out

1. What about the independent experts?
2. Carrrrrrlton! Carrrrrrlton! Carrrrrrlton!
3. And Visy sponsor the Blues! Way to skirt the cap, cheaters! AND he's not the only one!
4. Inadequate? We had two premierships taken off us for God's sakes, AND we had to play a whole season for nothing! I mentioned Brisbane because they got as many perks as Sydney did!
5. The reason why the crowds dropped was because of the Suns and the Giants. And they will continue to hold your precious game down. The SCG and Skilled Stadium were never big venues anyway.
6. Why aren't more incidents being reported to the AFL? Because they're scared to I'll bet, because the AFL are wimps!

For every answer you give you raise another fail, X. Keep going. This will be an epic fail real soon.

Striker wrote:

Xman wrote:

Striker wrote:

1. I'll believe that when I see it!
2. It's more than one that's been accused of it!
3. He's talking about Judd and all the other third party deals, X! Not the Crows!
4. And since we were punished we are still up there! And you forgot about the Lions and their three-peat!
5. And pigs fly as well.
6. 3 incidents huh? What about the ones that weren't reported?

Way to fail yourself, X!

1. Well the vast majority of AFL experts say this is inevitable.
2. Such as? Again, its finished now anyway
3. Judd? He has a contract with Visy. IS that not allowed? Wow, there goes sports sponsorship!
4. The storms punishment was shown to be inadequate. Whats this got to do with the Lions?
5. So renavations to the SCG and Skilled stadium didnt affect crowds? anyway we will see
6. Pffft. All we can judge is how the AFL acted on those incidents that were reported. They acted swiftly and harshly every time. Howd the NRL do? Nothing!

Continuing the failing striker. Strike out

1. What about the independent experts?
2. Carrrrrrlton! Carrrrrrlton! Carrrrrrlton!
3. And Visy sponsor the Blues! Way to skirt the cap, cheaters! AND he's not the only one!
4. Inadequate? We had two premierships taken off us for God's sakes, AND we had to play a whole season for nothing! I mentioned Brisbane because they got as many perks as Sydney did!
5. The reason why the crowds dropped was because of the Suns and the Giants. And they will continue to hold your precious game down. The SCG and Skilled Stadium were never big venues anyway.
6. Why aren't more incidents being reported to the AFL? Because they're scared to I'll bet, because the AFL are wimps!

For every answer you give you raise another fail, X. Keep going. This will be an epic fail real soon.

1. LOL show us these opinions. Show us one person who knows the game who says they wont be a very good side in short time
2. Evidence? If they are guilty they should be punished but wheres the evidence. Again, how can tanking be "rife" when only two teams have been accused and in selected years, and the priority pick is now gone?
3. If Judd has a contract with Visy and advertises them I dont see how that is salary cap rorting. Next youll claim the Australian cricketers shouldnt do ads for vodaphone because they also sponsor the cricket team. The AFL have been very hot on salary cap breaches for years now. If its inappropriate it wont last.
4. Retrospective! How did they ensure the Storm wouldnt win more? They never should have been allowed to win in 2009 because the NRL knew of their cheating but took a year to investigate it!
5. I agree they dropped because of these new teams. But as if they were ever going to average 36k home games! Skilled was down half a ground, the swans 1/3rd, and both sold out many times. Live TV for every game also hurt, as did double the number of games in Tasmania
6. What? The AFL have acted harshly on EVEERY racial issue. The CEO's comments resulted in the company being dumped. The racist fan was banned for life. The comments made by Rendell cost him his job. Meanwhile 50 NSW SOO fans got off scott free

Strike out again

1. There aren't any in the public domain because the AFL have a closed shop and won't let any independent experts in! How scared are they of real scrutiny eh?
2. HA! You said it was one and now you are admitting it was two! CAUGHT! And what about the rumours around Richmond?
3. Then why is the Visy deal suddenly an issue? It's a freaking rort, X!
4. We didn't win in 2009 because that was taken off us in case you forgot!
5. Skilled was down ONE STAND! Half my arse! I wouldn't know about the SCG but I'll bet it was the same. One stand.
6. And meanwhile a whole lot more goes UNREPORTED!!

Just admit it. Your game is not the high and mighty game you claim it is.

1. Oh my What utter garbage. The very experts claiming the Suns and Giants will be great teams in the future criticise the AFL freely on other issues. Seriously, you're hilarious.
2. Im not admitting its two because there's no evidence to sggest it is. However, even if it is, how is that "rife", especially when the priority pick is gone?
3. Because of the Tippett issue! It doesnt mean its a rort. Judd is well supported by a number of people in AFL circles. If his deal is found to be acceptable then he keeps it. Up until now the AFL have accepted it as outside his Carlton contract. Judd has never hidden the deal. Infact he's been very upfront with it. That is totally different to salary cap rorting where players deliberately hide extra payments from the club. How is Judd's Visy deal different to sponsorship?
4. You won 2009 despite the NRL actively investigating salary cap rorts for most of the season! It was their failure to do it in a timely manner that caused the entire season to turn into a debarcle! What about the teams that could have won that year? Wheres the justice for their players and fans?
5. What Skilled was missing half the entire ground! Average this year was 18k and it was sold out continuously. After completion it will fit 34k or almost double.
6. If they go unreported how can they be dealt with? Eels claimed the AAFL have a racist culture. A comment like this needs proof. Where is it?

1. Oh my look at the fool who doesn't know the difference between independent experts and AFL experts! So who's hilarious again?
2. You said: when only two teams have been accused! And it's three and all of them in AFL heartland! At least!
3. Because Visy also sponsor Carrrrrlton! And don't bring the cricket back into it because they don't have a salary cap.
4. We had it taken off us. Isn't that enough?
5. You idiot! All they did was knock down one stand. They had two other major stands and the whole section of the apposite end of the ground! That is NOT half the ground!
6. Hidden by scared victims who won't report the incidents because they know nothing substantial will be done. The AFL lacks intergrity and they know it.

Anything else? No?

Striker wrote:

1. Oh my look at the fool who doesn't know the difference between independent experts and AFL experts! So who's hilarious again?
2. You said: when only two teams have been accused! And it's three and all of them in AFL heartland! At least!
3. Because Visy also sponsor Carrrrrlton! And don't bring the cricket back into it because they don't have a salary cap.
4. We had it taken off us. Isn't that enough?
5. You idiot! All they did was knock down one stand. They had two other major stands and the whole section of the apposite end of the ground! That is NOT half the ground!
6. Hidden by scared victims who won't report the incidents because they know nothing substantial will be done. The AFL lacks intergrity and they know it.

Anything else? No?

1. Neither AFL or independant (who ever they are ) experts dispute the Suns and Giants will be great teams in the near future.
2. Who has been accused? Who is being investigated? Melbourne. That's it. If Evidence comes to hand that Carlton or any other team may have tanked in the past, its the past and in no way an indication tanking is rife. In fact its gone now anyway.
3. Again, Judd's Visy contract has been openly disclosed to the media and the AFL since its inception. How is that rorting when the AFL allowed it? Players have external sponsors you know...
4. Its a failing of the NRL who dragged their feet and made a sham of 2009. Its also an indictment on their punishment given they should never have won 2009 anyway so that retrospective punishment should have been prospective, and they have since played in 2 more GFs and won one. Therefore, how exactly were they punished?
5. They will go up 16k in capacity, almost double. Hmmmmmm
6. I'm sorry but thats just utter BS. Please show me 1 racial incident the AFL have not taken seriously and acted on promptly? Your accusation totally contradicts the 3 issues that occurred this year that were dealt with harshly. The NRl on the other hand did nothing on two very serious issues. Where's your criticism of their behaviour?

1. Independent = sporting experts who have no connection with the game whatsoever.
2. Only Melbourne is being investigated. Carlton and Richmond have been accused. And God knows who else got away with it!
3. Not sponsors that match the club they play for!! That's a freaking RORT!!
4. We lost players, and two flags. We had to play a season for no premiership points. Isn't that enough for you?
5. You are avoiding my point.
6. Where's your agreement with Goodes that plenty still goes on in the AFL and isn't reported?? What's the explanation for the lack of reporting? There's only one. Fear of the lack of integrity and the lack of action. I'll tell you what happens that they don't like. An apology is enough. If the AFL were really serious, racists should be delisted. For the record, the same should happen in the NRL.

1. Most independent experts (if you want to call sports journalists, AFL enthusiasts and ex AFL players not payed by the AFL): believe that the Suns and the Giants will probabaly pick up a few flags between them in the next 3-10 years. Anyone else doesnt really know what they are talking about so why listen to them.
2. Teams may be investigated for tanking but since the priority pick is no longer a factor (2010 onwards) tanking should in my opinion not be a factor in the future. However anyone found guilty wether it be Melbourne, Carlton, Collingwood or anyone else should get a big fine and lose draft picks.
3. Both the AFL and NRL will have clubs that break the salary cap rules in the future and as long as there is a salary cap, dodgy officials and player managers there will be problems. All you can do is abolish the cap or catch them cheating as best as you can
4. The AFL competition speaks for itself with having more winners of the premiership over the last 10 and 20 years then the NRL. If any comp is rigged it is the english premier league but that is because of money.
5. Crowd drops in 2011 and 2012 were expected due to new teams with lower stadium capacity then the league average, 4 live games on FTA where there use to be none and ground redevelopments. If this trend continues next year where there are no new changes this will be a worry but at this stage it is not an issue at all.
6. Go back to the early 90's players copped racism because other players saw that calling someone a black $%^$% really affected them and they could get away with it. Thank god that has changed it was a big blight on the game and it is no longer really a factor apart from the odd crowd member or very stupid player. when it does occur it has be brought to light and delt with harshly. Im not sure that RL has done the same, by all reports ignoring in recent SOO games racist taunts despite having many more pacific islanders and different (sorry if this is a bad description) looking people running out on the field. Soccer has also had its issues even more so despite being the most played sport around the world. This is and will probabaly be a major issue for all sports into the future but I think it is poor form by all trying to single out one competition and say that it is a racist competition, which many RL fans have done to AFL despite not really looking into whats really going on.