Talking Footy

Whilst the general gist of the Forum Guidelines in general are relaxed here, the following is strictly prohibited.

1. Extreme personal attacks
2. Slandering any code
3. Racial discrimination - including the reverse variety
4. Any negativity - promote your sport with positives in debate, or keep it neutral and level. That promotes healthy debate.

Two threads have been created that these guidelines do not apply to. One guideline though does apply even to those threads - and that's being on topic. Personal attacks would be off topic on those threads because I for one won't be reading the AFL attack thread (Mark can mod that).

I should point out that this is a Fight Club and there are two sorts of fighting. Fighting between grown adults - also known as debating - and fighting between non-adults. Debating is done by adults. Insults and so forth are done by non-adults. Now I'm all for being a kid now and then - hence the stickied threads for venting. But I'm also for robust adult debate AKA adults fighting like adults.

Seems fair enough. I think the venting threads are good start too.

Let's take this as an opportunity to set some member standards in the Fight Club. Sure many of us love a battle of the codes, but surely we can all agree that there needs to be certain guidelines in place.

Ok, over to you, feedback welcome.

I agree with all standards except for standard 4. It is highly ambiguous and seems to me to be contrary to the fundamental concept of the ''Fight Club".

I also disagree with the idea of having two threads simply for attacking RL or AFL. This is narrow and will not encourage any discussion. As TLPG stated he wont even read the AFL attack thread.

Finally TLPG's last point validates my point of how contrary to the Fight Club his ideas for change are. If this is what the members want (and I certainly dont) then you may as well change the title of the board to "Debate Club".

In my opinion it is obvious when one is really trying to offend. This should be punished accordingly. But what I have seen on these boards over the last few months has been nothing more than a bit of rough banter and fun. If people cant handle a joke then they need to grow some thicker skin or find another site which has a "Debate Club".

Thoughts?

Completely disagree with the last paragraph. KE never saw what I deleted from both Raider and Onions so he is in no position to make such claims.

KE also doesn't acknowledge what was written to explain standard 4 as to why it needs to be that way. I am now limiting my use of the term "thugby" to the ARL NRL thread for this reason - it's negative and provocational and I don't deny that even though I also believe it to be true.

Yes I did not see what happened between Raider and Onions but as a member of this site of course I am in a position to make such claims as I have been present and active much longer than you TLPG. So, I'll rephrase my claim. Why should the entire membership be punished and the complete structure of the fightclub need to change because of the actions of two members?

I think a more appropriate means would have been a warning or suspension to the two members, dont you?

Also TLPG you have failed to acknowledge that under your changes (not beaussies, which concerns me as beaussie seems to be having nothing/very little to say in the restructuring of his own site's most popular board) that the 'Fight Club' no longer holds the same meaning as it did. It is now a debate club for those who wince at being called something like 'Peanut'. And the NRL and AFL supporters have been effectively separated into separate 'safe' rooms

So I ask. Are the members of this site children who need to be controlled and separated in such a way? Or do we have an out of control moderator dictating the terms and conditions to suit himself, rather than the members of this site?

I strongly argue the latter and would hope that fellow members might also express their concerns to save the Fight Club and perhaps also Beaussies site from becoming a boring and dilapidated ghost town.

It's already a ghost town compared to other forums. People have left because of the lack of control. We can get them back once the dead wood is removed. In effect, you are trying to preach against rational debate. It is possible to do that without resorting to childish behaviour, and Raider and Onions haven't been the only ones - even though they are clearly the worst.

Rubbish,

While this place does not have many posting, it was all but empty when I first returned. About 3-4 active members posting. When I, along with a few others, provided plenty of provocational and interesting debate, the numbers jumped to about 12. 300% of what it was.

I dont think many have left as yet, but I'm positive many will stop bothering because the fight club is becoming a debate club with no freedom of speech.

Rather than destroy this sites most popular board why not make a 'Rational Debate' board then if this is what you want TLPG? I wouldn't argue with that. The fight club can and will be moderated successfully without you on it.

It will be successful in it's new format. I guarantee it. What you did was attracted children like Raider and Onions. I call that a bad thing.

I think we should put this issue to the members to decide as the sum of our members is more important than one new moderator.

Edited by TLPG: Removed extreme personal attack

TLPG is not the status quo and I'd like to hear from several of our other members rather than TLPG and Johnny come latelies like yourself hammerhead.

I also suggest that if TLPG's actions are endorsed then the name of the "Fight Club" be changed to better suit the changes that have been made to the board. As I've suggested on several occassions, it should then be changed to "Debate Club", with perhaps the add on "for those who do not have thick skin".

Then I will be happy for you all to have your debates in your rose coloured room and will refrain from trying to continue to fight for what the Fight Club has always been about.

Hammerhead wrote:

King-Eliagh, your attitude smells rather strongly of extremist liberalism. You appear to wish this board to become a stronghold of the American First Amendment.

BINGO!

Nail on the head, Hammer. That's exactly what I'm doing. Pushing this board away from Yank style bullying that such a thing would promote, and keeping rational adults away, and attracting children like Raider Dave and Onions.

KE is going to have to accept that "Debate" and "Fight" in an adult world is the same thing.

What Hammerhead and TLPG dont realise is this forum is being lead by a dictator rather than by its members. TLPG has, as far as I have seen, simply stamped his foot down and stated "these are the rules and if you dont like it you can giiiit out!" This is what I mean by dictatorship.

Alternatively, I've never insinuated or asked for anything like "extremist liberalism" you fools. I'm asking for freedom of speech and for those who cant handle being called a Peanut to grow some thicker skin. There's a whole wide world out there and if you cant handle such things you are ill prepared for it.

Finally I'm right, "Debate" and "Fight" mean very different things. Look them up in a dictionary. That's that book that tells you the 'meaning' of 'words'.

Dictionary meaning in this respect does not mean squat. Social interpretation is what counts - the two are the same to adults. Rational adults.

Freedom of speech comes with a price - a price that you, KE, are not willing to pay. You have a choice. Prove that you are a rational adult and fit in with the rules, or leave.

I'm looking for a place where 'fighting' is allowed. It's very unique to forums and as far as I can recall I think I was involved in the "fight club's' conception. I know it attracts members and participation albeit sometimes in need of control, but for the majority of the time fun and informative discussion garnished with good natured jibes.

If the members of the site would prefer my idea of the fight club to go and TLPG's idea of a 'debate club' to stay so be it. I'm not going to argue with the majority of active members but at the moment we only have one of TLPG's ring-ins and a Johnny come lately having any input into this debate.

As I suggested earlier, which I think was deleted by our dictator TLPG, I think it would be a good idea for this to go to a poll or put up as a separate thread to encourage members to take a stand. This has to be done quickly as it seems because TLPG has made changes already without consulting the members, several members have left already...

I am with King-Eliagh in this one, I want to fight to the death where the winner rules supreme over the world. None of this debating as that is for pussycats