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Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 7:57 am
by Raiderdave
Onions wrote:Raiderdave wrote:Onions wrote:
Turn it up! Another deluded **** wit hey? Populations of Melbourne, Perth and Adelaide is MORE than the combined population of Sydney and Brisbane so stick that up your arse and **** it! Perth will NEVER have an NRL team again. They have a Union team and that's the limit!
AFL is the national game and if you don't want to see that then YOU grow the **** up! Another little boy. You should change your user name to Puppies!
We have a lock on all five capitals, Raider Boy! When the Lions come around their average attendance will go back past the Broncos. The Swans average attendance is is biggest of all the clubs in Sydney! When West Sydney come in the Penrith and Parramatta average will drop below 10 K!
you have S.hit in 2
the biggest ... & the 3rd biggest
the Swans & Lions are gone .. seriously out the back door
GWS will never amount to anything
the suns ...will be saved from the wooden spoon in 2012 .. by GWS
They won't get it in 2011! Port Adelaide will!
You are proving yet again how deluded you are, Raider Boy! The Swans are going to play finals and the Lions will be back before too long. West Sydney will push Penrith and Parramatta to the brink!
did I say " another " wooden spoon ?...Suns will be bottom 2 for the next 3 years or so ... before breaking out ....
to be bottom 3
they'll be kept company by the Lions though ...
Swans Have played finals about 5 out of the last 7 years including 2 GF's .... so what ?
no one cares .. they couldn't get 20K to a game this weekend
& the only thing GWS will be pushing ... is sh.it up hill
as they win 3 wooden spoons in a row
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 10:36 am
by Beaussie
pussycat wrote:Beaussie wrote:
I would have thought double counting was a flawed analysis. Seems only NRL fans see such a flawed analysis as gospel. Deluded comes to mind when trying to understand your typical NRL supporters understanding of the Australian tv and broadcasting landscape.
My understanding is that these various Tam measurements are only for measuring televison sets, more specifically what your watching on them. If you happen to be in one of those duel signal areas, then assuming you are an NRL fan, your watching either c9 or Win - not both. So you would be counted by metro/regional Tam - not both.
As I outlined in the Origin thread in response to this issue, any household could be counted twice or more depending on what station is being watched in what room (eg: loungeroom on Channel 9, bedroom on WIN/NBN). It's not that difficult to understand the flawed system that is RegionalTAM when you consider that.
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 10:55 am
by Dogs
Beaussie wrote:pussycat wrote:Beaussie wrote:
I would have thought double counting was a flawed analysis. Seems only NRL fans see such a flawed analysis as gospel. Deluded comes to mind when trying to understand your typical NRL supporters understanding of the Australian tv and broadcasting landscape.
My understanding is that these various Tam measurements are only for measuring televison sets, more specifically what your watching on them. If you happen to be in one of those duel signal areas, then assuming you are an NRL fan, your watching either c9 or Win - not both. So you would be counted by metro/regional Tam - not both.
As I outlined in the Origin thread in response to this issue, any household could be counted twice or more depending on what station is being watched in what room (eg: loungeroom on Channel 9, bedroom on WIN/NBN). It's not that difficult to understand the flawed system that is RegionalTAM when you consider that.
I just called ozTAM as I am sick of the nonsense (here is the number if you or any of your AFL mates would like to confirm for yourselves: 61 2 9929 7210).
The response from ozTAM when I asked if there is any duplication of viewer counting bewteen Metro and Regional areas was as follows. There is definite overlap in some areas that can view both regional and Metro channels such as WIN and Nine. However, Metro only counts channel 9 and regional only count WIN etc. So there is no double ups.
Can I please ask you to update the other thread for me with the correct facts, oh no you will ignore this one. Keep pushing this and I will continue to be amused. This is proof again of another AFL stretch the facts moment.
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 11:16 am
by Dogs
Beaussie wrote:Dogs wrote:I had this conversation/argument with two AFL fan in the pub the other week. It is very interesting that you are all consistantly one eyed and only see a one side view in sport. I was happy to admit you have more members and supporter to the ground, however you want everything, even if it includes crap/lies ie more tv viewers. You guys will come to reality when we go through our next negotiation for tv rights.
=D> =D> =D> =D> =D>
You have never produced a tv deal worth anywhere near what the AFL has achieved. Keep dreaming sunshine.
Wow!!! You put something up with facts behind it, I am so impressed. Again that is the difference between you and I. I can admit you are correct. Now get back to the debate of the number of viewers. I am sure the two codes are going to be alot closer when NRL trumps AFL in the next negotiation. Then I can be really clever and say you have never produced bla bla ba
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 11:33 am
by Dogs
Beaussie wrote:Dogs wrote:Mr Beaussie. Let’s start again I proved my stats with website suppport, where is your backup. Again, until you produce some evidence, I will keep laughing at your correspondence.
I don't need to prove anything to you. The proof is in the fact/reality that only the commercial tv networks in the capital cities bid for broadcast rights and make the important programming decisions.
Dogs wrote:Your comments like regional stats are flawed, where is your proof and why? You forget the numbers balance with the same data all AFL fans use in your comments on multiple occasions and you continue to ignore it when it suits. Your continued lack of figures as I mentioned in my last update continue to amuse. Regarding stats as you put forward in your one eyed views, I do not see any proof (yet again) just bu**S**t comments with no supporting evidence (prove the double counting, without it being a AFL based website or blog).
The maps on the OzTAM and AGBNielsen sites show the overlapping areas where the double counting occurs.
Dogs wrote:Again, why is AFL only played in Australia and you only use five city counts, oh sorry forgot you only use figures that suit your correspondence and the fact that NRL is played in more countries then AU should be ignore haha.
Stop being so narrow minded. Australian Football is played all over the world.
Dogs wrote:You ask when was the last time the regional figure where included in negotiations and prove your one eyed b****** again. I am sure they will be put forward in the next negotiations which we will use real information on the table unlike yourselves. Double ups prove your comments champ, your figures exclude the real figure which we use rather than try to make excuses of so called double ups.
Again, the currency by which programming and broadcast rights are bought is based on the capital cities. When was the last time you saw executives from Prime, WIN or Southern Cross mentioned in the negotiations or at the negotiating table? Put simply, they don't count.
Dogs wrote:How good is your game really when you are rewarded for missing the goal and some of the highest paid player’s that is in your game come from rugby league to try and boost your unrealistic TV rights and popularity outside of melbourne. Interestingly, we are not chasing any AFL players as they can’t’ play our game. We trump your TV right figures (and will continue to sorry I have proof backing my arguement, I can't help that).
Oh dear, this rubbish above from a fan of a code that likes to call itself football, yet most of the play doesn't even involve the ball being kicked. Most of the players don't even know how to kick a ball in what can only be described as bash and barge. Oh and how about passing a ball backwards to go forwards. Great logic there.
Dogs wrote:That is the difference between you and I. We are happy to admit that more fans go to the ground to watch AFL in comparison to Rugby League as that is a fact, however significantly more rugby League fans watch the NRL on tv, regardless of what you throw at me.
Lastly, are your a national sport only when it suits you either there are people in Australia that live in the bush or they don’t? I grew up in the bush and I can assure you that AFL is not that well supported as much as you may like it to be.
Bullshit. If what you said was the case, the NRL would be valued more than the national jewel that is the AFL. As for that last sentence, what rot. Millions of people in the bush love Australian Football. How else would you explain the thousands of participants and competitons going on each and every week during winter right across the country. Why can't you accept the fact that the majority of Australians prefer our own game over the foreign import that is your game?
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 11:35 am
by Dogs
Dogs wrote:Beaussie wrote:Dogs wrote:Mr Beaussie. Let’s start again I proved my stats with website suppport, where is your backup. Again, until you produce some evidence, I will keep laughing at your correspondence.
I don't need to prove anything to you. The proof is in the fact/reality that only the commercial tv networks in the capital cities bid for broadcast rights and make the important programming decisions.
Is that because you can't proove it, I am not asking you to prove it to me. Just when posting something, that you back it up for all that read the forums
Dogs wrote:Your comments like regional stats are flawed, where is your proof and why? You forget the numbers balance with the same data all AFL fans use in your comments on multiple occasions and you continue to ignore it when it suits. Your continued lack of figures as I mentioned in my last update continue to amuse. Regarding stats as you put forward in your one eyed views, I do not see any proof (yet again) just bu**S**t comments with no supporting evidence (prove the double counting, without it being a AFL based website or blog).
The maps on the OzTAM and AGBNielsen sites show the overlapping areas where the double counting occurs.
Dogs wrote:Again, why is AFL only played in Australia and you only use five city counts, oh sorry forgot you only use figures that suit your correspondence and the fact that NRL is played in more countries then AU should be ignore haha.
Stop being so narrow minded. Australian Football is played all over the world.
Dogs wrote:You ask when was the last time the regional figure where included in negotiations and prove your one eyed b****** again. I am sure they will be put forward in the next negotiations which we will use real information on the table unlike yourselves. Double ups prove your comments champ, your figures exclude the real figure which we use rather than try to make excuses of so called double ups.
Again, the currency by which programming and broadcast rights are bought is based on the capital cities. When was the last time you saw executives from Prime, WIN or Southern Cross mentioned in the negotiations or at the negotiating table? Put simply, they don't count.
Dogs wrote:How good is your game really when you are rewarded for missing the goal and some of the highest paid player’s that is in your game come from rugby league to try and boost your unrealistic TV rights and popularity outside of melbourne. Interestingly, we are not chasing any AFL players as they can’t’ play our game. We trump your TV right figures (and will continue to sorry I have proof backing my arguement, I can't help that).
Oh dear, this rubbish above from a fan of a code that likes to call itself football, yet most of the play doesn't even involve the ball being kicked. Most of the players don't even know how to kick a ball in what can only be described as bash and barge. Oh and how about passing a ball backwards to go forwards. Great logic there.
Dogs wrote:That is the difference between you and I. We are happy to admit that more fans go to the ground to watch AFL in comparison to Rugby League as that is a fact, however significantly more rugby League fans watch the NRL on tv, regardless of what you throw at me.
Lastly, are your a national sport only when it suits you either there are people in Australia that live in the bush or they don’t? I grew up in the bush and I can assure you that AFL is not that well supported as much as you may like it to be.
Bullshit. If what you said was the case, the NRL would be valued more than the national jewel that is the AFL. As for that last sentence, what rot. Millions of people in the bush love Australian Football. How else would you explain the thousands of participants and competitons going on each and every week during winter right across the country. Why can't you accept the fact that the majority of Australians prefer our own game over the foreign import that is your game?
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 11:57 am
by pussycat
Beaussie wrote:[As I outlined in the Origin thread in response to this issue, any household could be counted twice or more depending on what station is being watched in what room (eg: loungeroom on Channel 9, bedroom on WIN/NBN). It's not that difficult to understand the flawed system that is RegionalTAM when you consider that.
In the case you just mentioned your using 2 television sets so you would have two viewers watching the footy. If someone is watching Win then why should n't they be counted? If sombody is watching NBN then they need to be counted also. If it's a case were somebody just left the other Tv on, by mistake, he is just as likely to leave it in Prime as NBN. Just as if it was the Brisbane metro area he just as likely to leave the second set on 9 or 7
The system isn't perfect but its not really any different to the to the Metro one that you swear by. There both open to the same flaws and short comings.
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 12:03 pm
by Dogs
pussycat wrote:Beaussie wrote:[As I outlined in the Origin thread in response to this issue, any household could be counted twice or more depending on what station is being watched in what room (eg: loungeroom on Channel 9, bedroom on WIN/NBN). It's not that difficult to understand the flawed system that is RegionalTAM when you consider that.
In the case you just mentioned your using 2 television sets so you would have two viewers watching the footy. If someone is watching Win then why should n't they be counted? If sombody is watching NBN then they need to be counted also. If it's a case were somebody just left the other Tv on, by mistake, he is just as likely to leave it in Prime as NBN. Just as if it was the Brisbane metro area he just as likely to leave the second set on 9 or 7
The system isn't perfect but its not really any different to the to the Metro one that you swear by. There both open to the same flaws and short comings.
Very interesting, how many tv's you got in your house BeAussie.
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 12:42 pm
by Dogs
I must confess my sins, I fell into the AFL world and just started posting info with no supporting facts. So I did some research and this is what I found.
Please refer to
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ci ... population and
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ranked_lis ... erritories
Go on suggest Wikipedia figures are wrong.
I am happy to admit my mistake of writing NSW instead of Sydney (BeAussie - great pickup, you’re so clever) and advise that you guys are correct, there are a massive 161 thousand more people living in the Capital Cities of Melbourne, Adelaide, Perth and Hobart when compared to Brisbane, Sydney and Canberra. (Onions, I gave you Perth as you are so intelligent that you know that Perth will never have a NRL team, so it must be true haha).
The Wikipedia figures shows that roughly 37% of Australians live in regional areas. This equates to a whopping 8.2 Million of the Australia’s population, (so I have no idea why we should be incorporating them in our debate haha). To break it down further 64% or 5.2 Million of them live in NSW and QLD. About the same as Melbourne and Adelaide Metro put together. Granted there are also 36% or 3 million in other regional areas which are AFL based states. With this info at hand most people in this debate can now really understand why you only want to talk about ozTAM 5 capital cities and will do anything to try and suggest that regional numbers are double counted or should not be included. Please ensure you take at look at my correspondence regarding the so called double counting. The ozTAM number again if you don’t believe me is: 61 2 9929 7210.
Also refer to:
http://www.thinktv.com.au/content_commo ... eports.seo
So based upon the info at so far I am going to again let you know (website above so we are on the same page) that NRL is pretty much always in the top 40 regional ratings for the Friday Night game/s and regularly in there for the Sunday game. There are 25 NRL appearances in the top 40 between the start of the season and the 9th of july. There are three weeks missing weeks so it could have been more. AFL however has not registered on a single occasion in the regional top 40. Within the combined Metro+Regional free to Air top 40 NRL has appeared 7 times compared to AFL’s 2.
It keeps being suggested that regional viewings are not in the negotiation table, this is the last thing I want to confirm. So guys, based upon what I have seen so far, I am not going take your comments as gospel.
Lastly, I note that none of you ever want to talk pay TV as there are blatant facts that you can't fluff around. Are you guys serious about a debate or just here to make up the numbers and crack the jokes!!!!
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 8:42 pm
by Onions
I'll "fluff" it around, by calling OzTam a pack of liars!! They are only worried about their little metro figures. What RegionalTam do is none of their fucking business because it's NOT THEIR JOB!!!!
There's an overlap, right? So double counting is UNAVOIDABLE!! The only way to avoid it is to shut off the fucking overlap!!
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 8:58 pm
by Dogs
pussycat wrote:Beaussie wrote:
I would have thought double counting was a flawed analysis. Seems only NRL fans see such a flawed analysis as gospel. Deluded comes to mind when trying to understand your typical NRL supporters understanding of the Australian tv and broadcasting landscape.
My understanding is that these various Tam measurements are only for measuring televison sets, more specifically what your watching on them. If you happen to be in one of those duel signal areas, then assuming you are an NRL fan, your watching either c9 or Win - not both. So you would be counted by metro/regional Tam - not both.
That is exactly the confirmation I got today from ozTAM, (the gospel only figures AFL fans wanted to use, apparently Onion now thinks they are liars) although as a NRL fan I am apparently delusional. I think this thread on a number of occassions has proven who is delusional.
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 9:38 pm
by Onions
Yeah - you are! If you think OzTam told you the truth about their fucked up operations!! I told you, in the fucking overlaps double counts are UNAVOIDABLE!!
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 9:44 pm
by Dogs
Onions wrote:I'll "fluff" it around, by calling OzTam a pack of liars!! They are only worried about their little metro figures. What RegionalTam do is none of their ******* business because it's NOT THEIR JOB!!!!
There's an overlap, right? So double counting is UNAVOIDABLE!! The only way to avoid it is to shut off the ******* overlap!!
No, double counting is not UNAVOIDABLE unless you like Beaussie are putting on two tv's in your house just to increase the AFL viewers. Are you suggesting that the figures you use for the 5 combined cities are wrong as ozTAM are all Liars? Talk about shooting yourself in the foot. If you believe your own comment, then this floors all AFL's arguments throughout and a number of other Threads and all your AFL mates regarding ozTAM Metro 5 City viewers. So you will not use regional because of so called double ups however your prepared to use the figures from the site you call a pack of liars. You are contradicting yourself.
You skipped the entire update and now people that prove you wrong are liars, not just NRL fans. Look out Beaussie he is turning on everyone. So now that you have embarrassed yourself, all your AFL supporters and basically confirmed to me that you have no real reason to listen to a thing you have said. Lets finalise this debate debate and discuss the other source of revenue, Pay TV. This is where a good chunk of your last negotiations $ came from. NRL has dominated Pay TV for years and is again this year. But nah we will never get the same $ as you guys. Give me a break. Happy to debate over these things, but you are way to unrealistic. Don't ever say NRL fans are one eyed. Present me some figures and I will admit I am wrong, but this comment proves regardless of what is presented to you, you still can't see the trees through the forest.
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 9:47 pm
by Onions
There are no fucking figures you dunderhead, because those two fucking up businesses run the whole fucking show!! They should be shut down and replaced for the lying scums they are NEVER telling the truth about anything! And they know it as proven by the scab of lies they fucking told you!!
Besides, the issue of double counting comes up when OzTam and RegionalTam are PUT TOGETHER!! As I said and I'll keep fucking saying it because it's true;
IT'S UNAVOIDABLE!!!
Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 10:04 pm
by Dogs
The whole thread started with ozTAM figures to suggest AFL had more TV rights. If you are suggesting this is the best we have. Then deal with the double ups as it is relevant for regional AFL viewers as well. We will all deal with double ups and playing with all the figures of all of Australia.
Happy for you suggest we need to remove the double ups (that I don't belive are there), but even if we do. How do you count the 8.2 million viewers in regional Australia. It is 37% of our country, so they need to be counted somewhere or somehow. You cannot just ignore them because you believe there are double ups.